Topic: Is Islam really the true religion?

[Moh__2222]

 

Lately I have been doubting that Islam is the true religion, I have even doubted the existence of God. Could you please tell me a proof that God exists and Islam is his true religion?

Thank you

[dnasims]

I do not respond to many posts here because I feel unqualified.  I am no expert at Islam or Muslim faith; however, I would consider my self very knowledgeable about this subject.

I have tried almost every Christian faith there is.  I have about ten different Bibles, three Holy Qurans, the book of Mormon for Mormon faith, four Tao Te Chings (Chinese faith).   Along with all of this, I have quite an extensive collection of philosophy, science, history, and others. 

All this to try to determine G_D really exist or not.  Along with which religion is correct.
I have spent thirty years at this exact question, and let me tell you the answer is NOT OUT THERE ANYWHERE.

It is in you in your heart, soul or what ever you believe in, when you find the Wright choice for you it will pull you to it with an unstoppable force.

This is what Islam has done for me so far.  I would never suggest to give up on any religion, but rather test others and pray for truth.  I do this all the time.  If Islam is the correct way then G_D will let you know you will feel it some how.

If on other hand you can not be convinced there is a G_D than nothing any person can say will change that.  Only you and G_D can change that, but either way you must follow how you feel and let no person alter your path.

I hope this helps you
Good luck
Dan Sims

[farrah]

Lately I have been doubting that Islam is the true religion, I have even doubted the existence of God. Could you please tell me a proof that God exists and Islam is his true religion?

Thank you

, I was going to ask this question too. Every body thinks that their Religion is TRUE.
Moreover Allah tells us not to say anything against any religion.
I have a feeling that all religions are good and people who are religious are better.
 

[Emilee]

Hello welcome to the forums.
 
I have attached an islamic book that speak about existence of God.
 
    If u want me, I can nicely explain it in a different post.
 

 

[Moh__2222]

Thank you Dan Sims and Emilee for you posts.

Emilee, the book is wonderful and it has some amazing stories but it is still not proof.

My point is a Creator may or may not exist, we simply can not know on our own, even after knowing how complex the universe seems to us, we still can not know if it was created or not. Right now, I think that God is just a theory that explains our existence and I want someone to prove to me that I am wrong as I really want to believe that someone cares for me and that I won't cease to exist after I die. But this belief does not seem rational to me.

As I said we can not know for sure if a Creator exists or not. If a Creator does exist, He either cares for us and wants us to know Him or He does not. If He does want us to know Him, He will make it clear for us that He exists. So if we say that He sent us a revelation it should be obvious that it is from a Divine being.

[Emilee]

 
 

Thank you Dan Sims and Emilee for you posts.

Emilee, the book is wonderful and it has some amazing stories but it is still not proof.

My point is a Creator may or may not exist, we simply can not know on our own, even after knowing how complex the universe seems to us, we still can not know if it was created or not. Right now, I think that God is just a theory that explains our existence and I want someone to prove to me that I am wrong as I really want to believe that someone cares for me and that I won't cease to exist after I die. But this belief does not seem rational to me.

As I said we can not know for sure if a Creator exists or not. If a Creator does exist, He either cares for us and wants us to know Him or He does not. If He does want us to know Him, He will make it clear for us that He exists. So if we say that He sent us a revelation it should be obvious that it is from a Divine being.

 Moh, we know God is not just a theory because Islam is not based on theory, but proof and logic. Qur;an is our proof that God exists.
You have to ask yourself from a logical point of you: "God is just a theory". What does that mean? That He exists, but you are all the way here, living aimlessly and everything ( the universe and the things in it) are working perfectly in order, without Noone taking care of it?
If there is no cause, then we wouldnt exist. If I write a post to you on something, and it looks all neat and in order, ofcourse u are going to know who wrote it. Thats the same case with universe, we know God is the creator because it says so in the Qur'an. And we know Qur;an is true, because it speaks of the future event that later came by, it speaks of true scientific facts recently discovered, about galaxy, human development...only recently discovered.

Ofcourse we know that universe is created, because everything that we can see and sometimes cannot see, but feel with our own eyes and senses is creation. But then we wonder how we cant see God if he exists?
This is because we were created with such purpose, with limited mind. Our minds cannot comprehend such unimaginable sight, because Allah made us that way. Allah says in the Qur;an that he created us to worship him only.
 and we do know he wants us to know He exists, thats why he has sent us releavations. Thats why he created us, didnt He?
If you read all the books ( divine releavations, such as Bible, Torah) you ll see that they are ll similar. This is because they were all authored by God, but were changed by people over periods of time. Qur'an was the only unchanged book, and many who tried to write anthing like  it failed. Do you personally know of someone who could produce Qur;an? No.
 
We can always say that there are things bigger then universe, and things bigger then that after universe. Islam teaches that Allah is a creator of everything and he is not like any of the creation. So if we are in universe, we always know the directions such as left, right, up, down.. But Islam teaches that God is not in a direction, because someone who created it cannot be it.
Do you understand what I am saying? Please browse through the forum and read about Islam.
 No matter how complex universe is, we know that it is still part of the creation. Islam teaches us that Tthe act of creation,  is frequently spoken of as a way of drawing the reader into thinking about the order in all things, and the All-Knowing Creator Who is behind it all.
 because Allah is Perfect and he can do anything.
We know Allah cares for us, because he created us and he wants us to do good in this world so that we can earn paradise in the hereafter. We know this because as mercy to all humanity and as guide to all humanity, God sent revealations over periods of time to prophets (e.g. Isa a.s. ( Jesus), Abraham, Adam (first man created) ) to teach people that there is one God and that if we work for good in this world, we ll earn paradise ( God willing).
Qur;an was the last releavation. So it was sent to all humanity and the prophet Mohammad (peace and blessings upon him). Qur;an states that after Qur;an there will be no more revelations. Qur'an was kept unchanged for 14 centuries. Thats what Qur;an states : " Ane verily, we ll watch it over it".
 
 
please ask me specific questions.

[Moh__2222]

First, thank you for responding. And please excuse me if I talk about the author of the Quran as if it wasn't God because I think this is how I should talk until it is proven that it is from a Divine being.

By "God is just a theory" I meant that in the past people didn't know how each phenomenon happened so they started to imagine a god for each phenomenon and as time passed this thought evolved to one God who is responsible for everything in the universe. What I am trying to say is that people didn't know how the universe came to be so they thought of an explanation for it.

You say that the Quran is proof. First what do you mean be "future event that later came by" Do you mean the victory of the Roman empire on the Persian empire? As for the scientific facts, I have read a lot of the "scientific miracles" on the internet and most of the ones I have read depend on either changing the interpretation of the verses or slightly changing the facts to suit each other. In fact the story of creation in Islam contradicts with modern science. This is how the story of creation goes: The sky and the earth were one thing then God split them and made the sky into seven heavens and lifted them without poles and made the earth into seven earths then God made the sun and the moon and ordered the sky to bring down water and ordered the earth to bring out plants then God created Adam he was 27 meters tall and created his wife they lived for about a thousand years (I am not sure if this part is true or not but the Quran clearly states the Noah lived for about a thousand years) and then humans decayed in size generation after another.

Doesn't this story clearly contradict with modern science and doesn't it more clearly contradict with the theory of evolution?

There are other things that make me think that the Quran is not from a Divine being for example in some verses the alternation of day and night and the ships are presented as signs. Doesn't this indicate that the author of the Quran was like amazed of how these ships float and move in the water and how the alternation of the day and night happened? Another thing: In the Quran it is asked: what will we do if there is only day and there is no night for example. The answer is simple, a lot of the individuals will suffer and some may die but some will be able to resist this change in the environment and generation after another micro evolution will happen, on the other hand if none of the individuals are able to survive we will simply become extinct. One more thing when I read the Quran I find it sometimes not organized well, at some points the author simply changes between subjects that are not related. If we study Arab poetry at that time we will find out that the poets at that time were more concerned about the beauty of each line alone and didn't care much about how the lines are related together. Could we take this as a sign that the author of the Quran was effected by his environment?

You said that no body could come up with something like the Quran. If this is true, does it mean that it wasn't made by humans? I mean every talented human being has his unique style in writing. The Quran challenges any human being to come up with Surah like the Quran, well Surah Yusuf is a perfect story, there are millions of perfect stories written by humans through out the ages, isn't that right?

I still hold on to my previous thought, we can not know if a Creator exists or not unless he tells us. The complexity of the universe and our existence do not point out to a Creator.

I will be grateful if you answer my questions, thank you again.

[Emilee]

i am glad for your questions. I ll answer to the best of my ability
One thing must be understood that The Quran is not a text book of Astronomy or Physics. As the primary function and intent of the Quran is the detailed discussion of practical matters related to Guidance and the Straight Path. By straight path, I mean to humanity following Qur’an and the prophet Mohammad ([eace and blessings upon him) in roder to earn paradise and save themselves from hell in the hereafter[/s]
When Qur;an talks about the iniverse, it is indeed not contradictory in line with modern science, indeed. I ll give you a few examples just to make it all easy on us to read.
 
 

For example.
Big Bang theory.
When describing the creation of the "heavens and the earth," the Qur'an does not discount the theory of a "Big Bang" explosion at the start of it all. In fact, the Qur'an says that "the heavens and the earth were joined together as one unit, before We clove them asunder" (21:30). Following this big explosion, Allah "turned to the sky, and it had been (as) smoke. He said to it and to the earth: 'Come together, willingly or unwillingly.' They said: 'We come (together) in willing obedience'" (41:11). Thus the elements and what was to become the planets and stars began to cool, come together, and form into shape, following the natural laws that Allah established in the universe. [/]The Qur'an further states that Allah created the sun, the moon, and the planets, each with their own individual courses or orbits. "It is He Who created the night and the day, and the sun and the moon; all (the celestial bodies) swim along, each in its rounded course" (21:33).
 
Muslims acknowledge that life developed over a long period of time, but see Allah's power behind it all. Descriptions of creation in the Qur'an are set in context to remind the readers of Allah's majesty and wisdom.[/]

Furthermore, the Qur'an states that "Allah created the heavens and the earth, and all that is between them, in six days" (7:54).
This verse that mentions “six days” uses the Arabic word “youm” (day).
 
This word appears several other times in the Qur;an, each indicating a different measurement of time.
In one case[/][/][/]The verses that mention "six days" use the Arabic word "youm" (day).
This word appears several other times in the Qur'an, each denote a different measurement of time.
 
In one case, the measure of a day is equated with 50,000 years (70:4), whereas another verse states that "a day in the sight of your Lord is like 1,000 years of your reckoning" (22:47).
 
The word "youm" is thus understood, within the Qur'an, to be a long period of time -- an era or eon. Therefore, Muslims interpret the description of a "six day" creation as six distinct periods or eons. The length of these periods is not precisely defined, nor are the specific developments that took place during each period.

Universe and all in it do in fact, point out at the creator who made all this. Everything that exists is Someone behind it all, making perfect order and sense in the universe.
Because its so complex, its easy to fall in a trap of thinking there is nothing beyond it, that this is it. That noone created it and God is just  a theory. But Qur’an is truly a divine message and if you look into it, you ll see it. Please take time to read through the forums and you ll disover great topics.
God is showing us his greatness through his creation and wants us to reflect on the nature. He wants us to think about the creation.


TBC
[ only wish to help you. ]

from the sources, credit : http://islam.about.com/od/creation/a/creation_2.htm[/]

[Emilee]

There are other things that make me think that the Quran is not from a Divine being for example in some verses the alternation of day and night and the ships are presented as signs. Doesn't this indicate that the author of the Quran was like amazed of how these ships float and move in the water and how the alternation of the day and night happened? Another thing: In the Quran it is asked: what will we do if there is only day and there is no night for example

No, it does not indicate that the Author was amazed at how these ships float and move at night.This is because it is a sign for us to see and reflect on the creation. Qur;an is a book of signs, not science.
 
Also, when there are questions asked in the Qur;an, it doesnt mean God doesnt know the answer to them , but the questions are appointed to us, asking us think and reflect. E.g. If i tell u now Moh, do you think I dont know that? you would tell me why is she asking me what she thinks, only she knows what she is thinking.
 

 read the Quran I find it sometimes not organized well, at some points the author simply changes between subjects that are not related. If we study Arab poetry at that time we will find out that the poets at that time were more concerned about the beauty of each line alone and didn't care much about how the lines are related together. Could we take this as a sign that the author of the Quran was effected by his environment?

No, because the language used in the Qur'an is quite different from any form of poetry, prose etc..
please read : http://www.islamonline.net/servlet/Satellite?c=Article_C&cid=1158658486403&pagename=Zone-English-Living_Shariah%2FLSELayout
 
Also,the verses are related to each other. I ll give u an example in the next post..
 
take care.
 
 
 

[Moh__2222]

Universe and all in it do in fact, point out at the creator who made all this. Everything that exists is Someone behind it all, making perfect order and sense in the universe.
Because its so complex, its easy to fall in a trap of thinking there is nothing beyond it, that this is it.

First why do you think that the universe points out to a creator? As I understand you use the same logic you use when dealing with something like "the computer is too complex, it has to have a creator" or something like the "First Cause argument" you know 
1. Every finite and contingent being has a cause.
2. Nothing finite and contingent can cause itself.
3. A causal chain cannot be of infinite length.
4. Therefore, a First Cause (or something that is not an effect) must exist.

First of all, our logic doesn't work for tiny things, I mean when you start talking in quantum mechanics terms things seem strange; an electron can be considered to be at two places at the same time and a particle can tunnel from one place to another. Why should we think that our logic also works for the universe?

Second, if we assume that the "Many-worlds interpretation" is correct, there will be no reason to believe that the physical constants in our universe for example point out to a Creator. My point is even if we don't know how the physical constants in our universe came to be in such a way to enable life to exist we don't need a Creator to explain it. Besides, we know that life evolved to suit the universe and not the universe was created to suit life.

Finally, if you believe that the First Cause argument proofs the existence of God. Why assume that the causal chain cannot be infinite?

I think you can understand my point now. We can't know if a Creator exists or not. So the only way for knowing that He exists is throw Him telling us. Now let's suppose that God did send us a revelation of some kind, I don't think we are expected to believe that it is from Him unless there is proof that it is from a Divine being. I have read the Quran several times and I have read a lot thinks that are considered as proof that the Quran is from a Divine being and most of them don't convince me. I will be happy if you show me something I don't know about the Quran that proves that it is from a Divine being.

For example.
Big Bang theory.
When describing the creation of the "heavens and the earth," the Qur'an does not discount the theory of a "Big Bang" explosion at the start of it all. In fact, the Qur'an says that "the heavens and the earth were joined together as one unit, before We clove them asunder" (21:30). Following this big explosion, Allah "turned to the sky, and it had been (as) smoke. He said to it and to the earth: 'Come together, willingly or unwillingly.' They said: 'We come (together) in willing obedience'" (41:11). Thus the elements and what was to become the planets and stars began to cool, come together, and form into shape, following the natural laws that Allah established in the universe. [/]The Qur'an further states that Allah created the sun, the moon, and the planets, each with their own individual courses or orbits. "It is He Who created the night and the day, and the sun and the moon; all (the celestial bodies) swim along, each in its rounded course" (21:33).

First thing please read Ibn Katheer's tafsir of the verses you mentioned. The story of creation was understood in the past the way I have mentioned in post #6. Do we change our understanding of the verses as we become more knowledgeable? Where is the miracle then? Now even if the verses of the creation of the universe don't contradict with modern science (although I still think they do somehow) Doesn't the story of the creation of human beings completely contradict with modern science?

    There are other things that make me think that the Quran is not from a Divine being for example in some verses the alternation of day and night and the ships are presented as signs. Doesn't this indicate that the author of the Quran was like amazed of how these ships float and move in the water and how the alternation of the day and night happened? Another thing: In the Quran it is asked: what will we do if there is only day and there is no night for example

No, it does not indicate that the Author was amazed at how these ships float and move at night.This is because it is a sign for us to see and reflect on the creation. Qur;an is a book of signs, not science.
 
Also, when there are questions asked in the Qur;an, it doesnt mean God doesnt know the answer to them , but the questions are appointed to us, asking us think and reflect. E.g. If i tell u now Moh, do you think I dont know that? you would tell me why is she asking me what she thinks, only she knows what she is thinking.

Do you think the ships that float and move in the sea are signs for the existence of God?
Do you think the alternation of day and night is a sign for the existence of God?
If so please give me a reason for this.